The Winter Buzz ! (Factors, Winter 101)
Go to group page

Big Storm Lurking? Feb 5-6?

Screen shot 2013-01-29 at 1.31.15 PM

 

A lot of interesting things are going on in the tropics right now that point to the Madden Jullian Oscillation going into the cold and stormy phase of 8-1.  We are currently in a phase 7 and as we head into February phase  7 becomes a much warmer phase hence the 60's we are going to feel tomorrow.  But as the pattern reloads we are beginning to see signs of a quick east movement of the MJO.  Models originally wanted to stall in phase 7 for a little bit before moving east, but IR and latest model data says that will not be the case.  

 

First a healthy tropical cyclone off Madagascar is our first clue of the eastward propagating MJO.  Tropical Cyclone Felleng is developing nicely under increasing upper air divergence.  The main bulk of the convection is now pushing east spreading from the dateline towards 160W.  Convection over Brazil is very phase 8ish but we are currently lacking convection where the black circles are located.  As stronger upward vertical velocities push over this area convection is expected to increase.  This should occur over the next few days. 

 

Now what does a phase 8 mean for us...

Screen shot 2013-01-29 at 1.46.25 PM

 

A negative NAO and a positive PNA and a negative AO!  Too good to be true.  

 

This kind of set up applied to the ensembles (although it is only 2 members right now) the confidence amongst ensembles and operational models is low for this event.  But something to watch for is this pattern above setting up for this event or a potential event down the road:

Screen shot 2013-01-29 at 1.53.17 PM

 

The operational run was actually a great one for snow (See below) but it did not have our ingredients.  It did this with a positive NAO.  In this type of set up a positive NAO could deliver a good snow event but only of weak to moderate significance.   The bigger event needs more blocking.  And without a negative NAO we are vulnerable to a warmer solution as shown on a few ensemble members.   But in the two frames above one labeled with the neg NAO and 50/50 and the other directly above it show a coastal going up the coast.  The one not labeled shows more of a New England snow event, but the one labeled is a huge hit for the Middle Atlantic.  

Screen shot 2013-01-29 at 1.54.02 PM

 

Many ensemble members show this event and all have a different solution, but there are fall in pretty much 3 categories.  The first being a weak warmer event, the second being a snow event low to moderate level, and the third being a big hit.  The 50/50 low outlined above is showing up in different areas, but for the most part it is in a general area to allow us to benefit from a snow event.  Whether it be a trace-2" event or a 3-6" event or a 6+" event is the question.  

 

MODEL DIFF

Screen shot 2013-01-29 at 2.12.38 PM

 

The Canadian model above does show a nice moderate snow event for the Middle Atlantic but notice the very strong low.  This is our weekend clipper system that bombs out and it heads north.  The GFS says that is not going to be that strong:

Screen shot 2013-01-29 at 2.15.21 PM

 

The European model agrees with the GFS but the GFS ended up showing a nice snow event for the Middle Atlantic also.  The Euro shows a non event as the polar vortex stays strong over the Hudson Bay helping to accelerate the northern stream ahead of the southern stream. Notice the lack of separation between the PV and the northern stream s/w, this results in a non event.

Screen shot 2013-01-29 at 2.18.12 PM

 

Conclusion:

 

-Models are going to be all over the place the next few days with this system

 

- Models need to get the Saturday clipper right before coming to a conclusion on this system

 

- Potential exists anywhere from a big snow storm to nothing depending on the blocking or lack thereof sets up

 

-Many solutions in this set up will deliver snow of some kind to the Middle Atlantic, but most would be anywhere from a trace to a few inches.  

 

CLICK HERE FOR ROB GUARINO BLOG ON THUR/FRI SNOW & STORMS

Blog started by Mike DeFino , on 115 days ago
You need to be a member of this group before you can participate in this discussion
John Manetta
My posts can be seen on "gfs and euro trending up for snow" by Rob. For people that are new to weather, combined with Mikes discussion, it may assist in understanding why there is the possibility some models are missing this entirely, so far.
114 days ago
 
John Manetta
When I discussed the possibility of a negative nao and 50/50 low a couple of days back, I mentioned a couple of things that are important for anyone attempting a forecast/prediction on this. Firstly, the polar vortex being more disorganized or at least displaced from where the ecmwf has it would help. Secondly, it is important not to focus on one run or another, especially off runs that have less data input. Thirdly, it may very well happen farther out in the forecast period. Also bear in mind that at this point the ensembles are more important then the operational, any trend one way or another will be seen in individual ensemble members first as has been discussed already.
114 days ago
 
Reggie Smith
I can see us even beginning to miss out on the clipper snows as the storm track lifts north.
115 days ago
 
Reggie Smith
this pattern just does not want to yield us any storms over five inches
115 days ago
 
Kevin Reilly
A couple of model runs are hinting and blocking from the NAO but it is a wait and see for sure...

At this point right now if we do not get the blocking get used to nickle and dime snow events and nothing but passing cold shots of air that are here for like 4 days and leave... then we herald on Spring and Severe Weather Season... which will in my opinion be quite active due to these cold shots.
115 days ago
 
DerrickG
It is what it is....Cmon on euro show this GFS how it's done.
115 days ago
 
tim riggins
Newest GFS just came in and this storm looks nothing like the 12z, no southern precip, looks exactly like another clipper.

Wow, nothing like the last couple runs of this. Completely different setup. Not even .10 precip from this. This seems like the same as the last storm, looked good this far out then it completely lost this storm.
115 days ago
 
SgtSnow
I hate clippers almost as much as back end snow and the Flyers specialty teams.
115 days ago
 
Jonathan Wenner
As much as I don't want to jinx it, it at least looks like a last Friday repeat if not a few inches more. I think it just blows up too late to give us a huge storm as of now.

Yes, the spring and summer are looking above average, but again HUGE GRAIN OF SALT with long range forecasts
115 days ago
 
Marcus wild
Well at least we have 2 clippers one Friday one Sunday to tide us over.
115 days ago
 
SnowSlaughter
Its easy to say a big storm wont happen simply because of all the factors that must be right.
115 days ago
 
Reggie Smith
lol, nkay of course if COULD be but thats not saying much. Chances are it will not! I hope I am wrong but this just doesnt setup is not very good. Much like the last storm where we got 3 inches off of high ratios.
115 days ago
 
nkay
i dont know guys. this could be the major snowstorm we've been waiting for! What do you think?
115 days ago
 
Charles
I agree reggie this is going to be another miss!!! And if it is a miss I think winter will be over!
115 days ago
 
Reggie Smith
The 18z gfs has a weaker storm. Take it for what it is, but I think this storm is gonna fizzle like our last chance of getting a bigger storm. Very similiar setup just not as cold an airmass over us.
115 days ago
 
Adnorl
Mike,
I saw on TWC last week that they are predicting a warm March and April. Does the phasing show we are coming into a warmer period early in the year?
115 days ago
 
Steve Eisenhower
Mike, with Phase 7 moving more quickly does that mean colder temps for the longer term and not the warm-up for mid-month I saw forecasted yesterday ?
115 days ago
 
Heat Island 718
The missing ingredient would be the blocking over greenland. Before we had the blocking but we didnt have the cold air. Now we have the cold air but dont have the blocking. This the reason why we've had little phasing this year no blocking. Time is of the essence which = blocking= Neg NAO= snow of 6+ inches.
115 days ago
 


weatherrush


masterthemets
Tuccson Computer Consulting
Tuccson Computer Consulting

Users Login

This is the Log-in area, Please go to the BLOGS for registration.